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 Post subject: Flap installation
PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2011 10:33 pm 
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Hi all,
I'm really enjoying the build so far, it's been 3 weeks or so and it's moving fast. Can someone tell me what size bolt will hold the control cables to the lower end of the flap handle and how the cables are attached. The manual doesn't really describe it. Are the cables swagged and attached with a turnbuckle (AN3?)?

Any help would be great..

Thanks
Gary


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 Post subject: Re: Flap installation
PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2011 11:02 pm 
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The Bill Of Materials calls for an AN3-11A bolt, AN970-3 penny washers, AN960-10 regular washers and an AN365-1032A nyloc nut. The cable ends are wrapped around F-2510.0 (AN111-3) cable bushings and secured with Nicopress sleeves.

When the manual leaves me stumped, I go back to the BOM and search for the application to see what's specified. Because the BOM is listed digitally, not numerically, it's a little goofy. For instance, an AN3-11A comes before an AN3-5A. But, once you get used to that quirk, you can use the BOM to find part specs.

Sometimes the applications are a little obscure, so I just look for generic terms. When looking for the flap cable bolt, I looked through all the AN3 bolts for those with "flap" in the Description. And there it is: "Flap Connection - Bolt". I also check the quantity specified to be sure it makes sense.

I'm pretty sure the "750 hours" build time estimate doesn't include the time we spend digging through the BOM. :? But it's a very handy tool.

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Richard Holtz
Highlander N7340Z -- in gestation

If just enough is really good, then too much ought to be perfect.


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 Post subject: Re: Flap installation
PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2011 11:27 pm 
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Any pictures would really help.....

Thanks


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 Post subject: Re: Flap installation
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 12:00 am 
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There's a picture on page 96 of the new manual with the writeup. It's Figure 10.8.7 in the old one.

Interestingly, there's a part conflict in the new manual. The BOM that I have calls for an AN3-11A (undrilled) bolt and AN365-1032A nyloc nut. The actual fasteners aren't specified in the old manual; I had to figure it out using the BOM.

But the new manual calls for an AN3-12A (undrilled) bolt, with an AN3-10 castle nut and an AN380-2-2 cotter pin. It's pretty hard to use a cotter pin through an undrilled bolt, so we need to get that resolved. Either the manual or the BOM (and the supplied parts) needs to be changed. I don't know what parts are specified in the new BOM.

I used an AN3-12A bolt, and used the nyloc for my rough assembly. I haven't installed cables, yet, so I don't know where the turnbuckles go.

(I notice that there's a typo in that same paragraph. It calls for AN113-3 cable bushings, but it should be an AN111-3. The correct part number is in the BOM, and the correct parts are supplied.)

I'll email the questions to the factory and get some guidance for us.

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Richard Holtz
Highlander N7340Z -- in gestation

If just enough is really good, then too much ought to be perfect.


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 Post subject: Re: Flap installation
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 12:05 am 
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I don't have my copy in front of me, but the online version of the manual does have a few pictures of the flap handle area. It shows the washers, bolt, nut, thimbles and cable ends as indicated by sheepdog, and other pictures show turnbuckles on the vertical runs up the sides of the fuselage.

Each cable is on opposite sides of the flap handle.

In response to the drilled/undrilled, due to the possibility of rotation I would think the drilled/castle nut would be best. Also, on a related note, why do they specifically call for a nyloc on the elevator bellcrank? As important as that is, and the fact that it rotates should necessitate a castle nut with cotter pin.

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Dane

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 Post subject: Re: Flap installation
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 12:06 am 
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I debated posting on this at all, but figured I would just in case.

I don't remember what the manual said to do in my case, but I used a nyloc nut to fasten the flap cable ends to the flap handle. There is some rotation to this bolt - at the nut fell off in my hand at 2nd condition inspection. This would have led to one flap up/one down - a bad situation :shock: . That one needs to be a castellated nut, IMHO.

fwiw

k


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 Post subject: Re: Flap installation
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 1:13 pm 
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KevinC wrote:
. . . That one needs to be a castellated nut, IMHO.

I agree, Kevin. Nylocs are good at applying tension in a tight joint, but not as good at resisting rotation in a loose joint.

I talked to Scott at the factory. He said that, on his own flap cable attach system, he used an AN3-12 (drilled) bolt with a castle nut and cotter pin. I recommended that they change the manual and BOM to include those parts, and I'll use them on mine, too.

I think if I was already flying mine, I'd look at your experience and replace those parts at annual or even sooner, since they're accessible.

danerazz wrote:
. . . Also, on a related note, why do they specifically call for a nyloc on the elevator bellcrank? As important as that is, and the fact that it rotates should necessitate a castle nut with cotter pin.

The elevator bellcrank is mounted to the fuselage attach point with a drilled bolt and castle nut with cotter pin. The bolt should be greased.

But the control rods attach to the bellcrank using undrilled bolts and nyloc nuts. Scott said that's because the bolt and nyloc nut are supposed to hold the fork tightly onto the inner race of the bearing and lock it in place. All the rotation is supposed to be in the bearing itself.

That makes sense to me, so I'm okay with using nylocs there.

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Richard Holtz
Highlander N7340Z -- in gestation

If just enough is really good, then too much ought to be perfect.


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 Post subject: Re: Flap installation
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 2:25 pm 
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The key there is "supposed" to not transfer he rotation to the bolt. I guess it makes sense, as long as it is tight enough to ensure no bolt rotation, and checked carefully as applicable.

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Dane

Paralysis by analysis
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 Post subject: Re: Flap installation
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 8:06 pm 
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Thanks for the input guys. Is there another on-line manual other than the one on the Just website. The one on the website matches what they sent with the kit but I don't see any pictures other than what's shown in chapter 1 (Fuselage). Pictures 14.1, 14.2, 14.3a, 14.3b

Thanks


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 Post subject: Re: Flap installation
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 10:39 pm 
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I had the old manual, but it doesn't seem to want to open correctly for me right now. There were pretty much the same pictures but in color for the flap handle.

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Dane

Paralysis by analysis
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 Post subject: Re: Flap installation
PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2011 1:26 pm 
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The new manual is based on the old one, but it's redone so it follows about the same order as the build. I haven't done a side-by-side comparison, but I haven't noticed that anything omitted, and there are some new things added.

I submitted several pages of refinements while the revision was in progress, and I have more for the next edition.

If you have suggestions on the manual, fax or email or mail them to the factory. We'll all benefit when we build our next Highlanders.

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Richard Holtz
Highlander N7340Z -- in gestation

If just enough is really good, then too much ought to be perfect.


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 Post subject: Re: Flap installation
PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2011 6:32 pm 
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Yeah, but we will have our first ones right there to look at for answers!

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Dane

Paralysis by analysis
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