Page 1 of 1

Instrument Panel Interferes with Control Stick

PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 3:24 pm
by jjacky
Hi Again. I'm in the process of mounting the semi complete instrument panel. I finally checked the clearance between the control stick with a Ray Allen ball-o-switches mounted on top and it adds about an inch. The control stick hits the original instrument panel about an inch and a half up from the bottom. I say "original ...panel" because (the rest of the story) I went to great pains to make an auxiliary instrument panel to contain heater ports , cigarette lighters (there's nothing like a big fat stogie when your cruising over mountains) and the GRT Engine Monitor. It hangs an additional 3 inches below the original panel so I am well and truly screwed. So the options are: Saw the control stick off to a convenient length where the load is not to much or to uncomfortable for my wife (5' 10" and sometimes embarrassingly strong) ....OR...Get some bent sticks that curve back...OR ..is anyone willing to send or post plans for a bent stick that they find comfortable..OR ...I'm all ears...Thanks.

The best laid plans....

Re: Instrument Panel Interferes with Control Stick

PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 5:15 pm
by BucF16
Oh we need PICTURES of that panel!

:roll: :lol:

Re: Instrument Panel Interferes with Control Stick

PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:12 pm
by jjacky
OK..some photos of the stick without the Ray Allen ball-o-switches on top. That would add about an inch to the stick. The panel is split so you're only seeing the lower section
CameraZOOM-20170807185614969.jpg

CameraZOOM-20170807185655317.jpg

Re: Instrument Panel Interferes with Control Stick

PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:20 pm
by FlyerChief
The best solution may be a combination of an offset and shortening the stick a bit. I cut an inch and a half off mine and it was no issue... still lots of authority on the control surfaces, but a friend of mine cut and welded his to get a one and a half inch offset, which works well too. Here's a post from a few years ago... check out the pdf's attached to his post. http://www.wingsforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=218&t=21932&p=38705&hilit=offset+control+stick#p38722
Don't forget you may also need an inch or so clearance for your thumb if you need to push a button with it while flying. :wink:
Dan

Re: Instrument Panel Interferes with Control Stick

PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 9:22 pm
by SheepdogRD
Check with the factory -- they may be able to provide the curved sticks.

Re: Instrument Panel Interferes with Control Stick

PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 9:37 pm
by BucF16
So I see the piano hinge for the upper panel. What's up there? Curved control sticks can be bent with "conduit" benders. That may be your best bet with you have already installed. Just one builders's opinion.

Thanks for sharing! It looks like good workmanship!

Bruce

Re: Instrument Panel Interferes with Control Stick

PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2017 8:41 am
by alan
For curved sticks I went to a sporting goods store and bought a couple of bicycle add-ons that attach to the front of ten speeds so the cyclist can rest his forearms on the original bars with his hands pointing forward and grip the new bars. It cuts down on drag while racing.

Alan

Re: Instrument Panel Interferes with Control Stick

PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2017 11:20 am
by jjacky
Great..Thanks guys ..good ideas all. Bruce the upper panel's going to contain a GRT Sports EFIS, a couple of handheld Nav/Comms, Xponder, a couple of Marine fuse blocks, an AOA indicator, a cell phone and a I pad for she-who-must-be-obeyed and maybe an Oil Pressure gauge and maybe (and this maybe a little nuts) a self sealing tube from the panel to the engine compartment big enough to allow me to spray a bunch of Halon or ABS through. :?

Re: Instrument Panel Interferes with Control Stick

PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:36 am
by keithGA
jjacky wrote: ...and maybe (and this maybe a little nuts) a self sealing tube from the panel to the engine compartment big enough to allow me to spray a bunch of Halon or ABS through. :?



I'll agree (respectfully) that this is "a little nuts." Without installing fire detecting loops and sensors, by the time you see the flames or smoke coming out the cowl, your only concern should be getting the aircraft on the ground... NOT fighting the fire.

Additionally, I've flown many thousands of hours on turbine aircraft where fire detection systems are required and they are often troublesome. Lastly, the pressure differential between engine compartment and cockpit won't work in your favor.

Re: Instrument Panel Interferes with Control Stick

PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2017 11:40 am
by R Rinker
If it's any comfort, the highest probability of fire in the engine compartment would probably be during start up and taxing out. Don't know the actual stats on that, but would suspect so...

Re: Instrument Panel Interferes with Control Stick

PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2017 12:25 pm
by Tralika
jjacky,
The nice thing about building our own planes is we can build them any way we want. However you should consider how effective your firefighting system would be. Your cowling is vented to maximize cooling air movement. The tube you describe may deliver firefighting agent through firewall but it will meet a blast of air that will direct it out the bottom or your cowl. The firefighting agent would really need to be delivered right at the seat of the fire to have any chance to be effective. Since you have no way of knowing the exact source of a potential fire your not going to be able to build build the exit point of your tube with any accuracy. If you use a dry chemical fire extinguisher I'm not sure how well it would disperse out the end of a long tube. Fire extinguishers nozzles are designed to disperse the agent in a certain pattern to maximize effectiveness. If you shoot it out through a long tube it might come out in a big blob or even plug up in the tube. You might try to test your design by discharging a fire extinguisher through a tube and see what happens on the other end. A Halon gas type agent might work better but it's still going to get blown out the bottom of the cowl. Keep in mind that the little fire extinguishers carried in small GA airplanes are not going to put out much of a fire.

Also I'm trying to imagine the process of immediate action to an engine fire in flight, shutting off fuel, electric, ignition, pitching down aggressively, locating a landing area, turning on the ELT, briefing your passenger, setting up an approach to that landing area and at the same time pulling out a fire extinguisher, connecting it to the delivery tube mounted on our under the panel and keeping it connected while discharging the fire extinguisher. I'm just not sure how practical it would be.

Re: Instrument Panel Interferes with Control Stick

PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2017 1:34 pm
by FlyerChief
John is right on the money with the dispersion of extinguishing agent under the cowl... it would be unpredictable at best and ineffective at worst. ABC chemical extinguishers are cheap and effective, but you can write off everything under the cowl after you've discharged it. The power gets into the tiniest of cracks and can be very corrosive to electrical connections and components as well as your engine. CO2 is good, but the extinguishers are very heavy, so Halon is a better choice, but Halon and CO2 work by eliminating the oxygen required for combustion, so the airflow into the cowl for cooling the engine would likely render either one ineffective. You can't displace the oxygen when there's a fresh supply of it coming into the engine compartment continually.

You are better off trying to keep combustible materials to a minimum in your plane and try to get on the ground quickly in the event of an in-flight fire.
Your fire emergency checklist should be memorized and similar to what John mentioned "shutting off fuel, electric, ignition, pitching down aggressively, locating a landing area, turning on the ELT, briefing your passenger, and I would add call out a "Mayday" on 121.5mhz or other local frequency if there's no time to switch it.
Dan

Re: Instrument Panel Interferes with Control Stick

PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2017 2:43 pm
by jjacky
Great...Thanks for the Sanity check guys